Laura on Linkedin

Shopping in Zurich train station

Homegate for renting an apartment

Zurich Together for expat events

Switzerland Travel Centre for trips

Government website for relocation

Kathrin: Hello everybody, and welcome to another episode of Living in Switzerland. The series is brought to you by Rigby. We are a staffing and project services company based in Zürich. If you or anyone you know of is looking for a new role in Switzerland, or if you're looking to hire, let us know. We'd be happy to help.

The best way to do that is by going to rigby.ch/apply and filling out the form. Then if we have anything that might be of interest, we'll gladly let you know. Today, we're very excited to talk to Laura Vrinceanu, who got her job through Rigby. She moved to Zürich, Switzerland a year and a half ago to work for Julius Bär Bank.

As we all know, in today's world, data is becoming more and more important to us. And most organisations are data-driven. Laura is a Tableau developer with a passion for data analysis and visualisation. With seven years of experience under her belt, she is committed to never stop learning and strive for excellence in her field of work.

Laura, welcome to the podcast.

Laura: Thank you, Kathrin. Happy to be our guest today.

Kathrin: Excellent. So could you tell us just a little bit about yourself and your background?

Laura: Kathrin, I am one of the few lucky ones. I am able to do what I love as a job. And that is so important to find that one thing you are passionate about and can do consistently for a career. But of course it didn't happen overnight, it is a process and in my case it meant spending years exploring new skills, new technologies.

The university I attended was not IT-focused but I did go to many courses and qualifications, based on what I needed at the time. So just gathering experience hands-on, trying to discover my strengths when it comes to work, being curious about what other people in my organisation are doing and how they are doing it, trying to see where I would fit in and where I can contribute with the best of my abilities. And also always staying true to myself and what I enjoy doing. So at one point it was clear to me that business intelligence could be a good choice, because I can put my analytical skills to the test every day, while remaining an artist at heart, you know, and be able to stay creative and focus on the visual to convey a message and tell a story. Even more than that, just being in constant communication with people is another thing I really enjoy doing. Getting to listen and understand what my clients need and contribute with my expertise, share my knowledge. Now more recently from my position as a Senior Dev, I get to spend part of my time teaching others that are at the start of their career or just their journey in the BI world. And that is really exciting. And it's also something I, plan to do more in the future. Both at my job and outside of it. It could be trainings, tutorials. I can start a YouTube channel I don't know, or even a podcast.

Kathrin: That's right. Yeah. Starting a podcast is highly recommended. Of course.

Laura: Yeah. Today. Yeah. And I'm having so much fun today, so I can try that no matter the channel I will focus more on giving back to the world and helping others because that is most fulfilling at the end of the day.

Kathrin: Right. And it sounds like there's a lot of sort of practical application in what you do. You didn't sort of spend years and years at a university just in theory, did you? And that's of course very good for Switzerland because the Swiss tend to like the practical side of things. They're much, many more people do apprenticeships in Switzerland rather than, you know, going to university. So it sounds like you were a really good fit for coming to Switzerland.

Laura: Yeah, it is. I feel that hands-on experience is also important. The studies matter too but at the end of the day you need that experience, you know?

Kathrin: That's right. Yeah.

So why or how did you become interested in Switzerland specifically?

Laura: Well, Switzerland chose me and not the other way around. I am originally from Romania and I've built my experience mostly working for international companies based in Bucharest.

I was always looking forward to the next step in my career, you know, and at some point I felt I could expand my horizons even more if I would take a job in another country. So I started looking into some options considering this idea and at some point I got drawn to the American dream and was looking to find a job and relocate to the U.S., but that can be tricky and it took a while. But when you're looking to relocate, besides your personal preferences, what matters is also how big the demand is for people in your field of work, and I guess that's what's happened in my case.

There is a high demand for IT professionals and especially BI developers in Switzerland.

I started getting job offers and participating in interviews. I got a sense of what people are looking for and really started considering Switzerland as a real option for me.

Kathrin: Right. Yes. There is a shortage, isn't there, of IT, like really qualified IT professionals.

Laura: Yeah. I have to admit that before that I didn't know much about the country except for the famous cheese, chocolate, you know, the Swiss Alps.

Kathrin: Yeah, that's right.

Laura: But that's not nearly enough to know about the country you're looking to move to. So yeah, I really had to start an extensive online research.

Kathrin: And how did that go?

Laura: Well, what I can tell you is that now I know you shouldn't believe everything you read online.

Kathrin: That's true. Yes.

So did you find that the experience is quite different to what you read online?

Laura: Well, I did spend a lot of time on researching online. Because usually I am that kind of person. I like to cover everything beforehand and gather all the facts and information that I can possibly have and then make rational decisions based on that, but somehow this way of being worked a bit against me because the internet can be wild it can cause you to worry and double guess yourself at some point I was like, “Is this really a good thing for me? What am I getting myself into?” So it is a lot of information out there and you never know what's true and what not.

Kathrin: That's right. And Switzerland is so diverse as well that some, a single person's experience might be so completely different to yours. that you can't really base your opinion on what someone else's experience was, can you?

Laura: Exactly. You only know when you experience it yourself. It is exactly what happened in my case. The move itself in reality was effortless, and I can say even enjoyable like every step of the way with every milestone, I was just realising that this was way easier than I expected. And it went exactly like it should, no surprises.

Kathrin: Oh good.

Laura: It's sort of like when you arrive here the universe just works in your favour.

Kathrin: Well, that's good.

Laura: Yeah. And this is one thing that you come across all the time when you research Switzerland. The fact that there are a lot of rules and people like to follow them. But only after you experience it here, you realise that it just makes everything run smoothly.You know what you have to do and everybody else does too. So a process like relocation, for example, just runs seamlessly from start to end.

Kathrin: Because there are all these rules set up and everybody knows how to act and what to do.

Laura: Exactly.

Kathrin: Right.

Laura: Even with difficult situations, like in my case my biggest worry was finding an apartment to rent because I learned that it can get very challenging to find a place in Zürich. Not only in the city, but also in Canton Zürich, because the demand is so high.

Kathrin: That's right.

Laura: It can be quite a process to find rent. You can be subject to checks. You know you need a reference from someone living here, or you need to have a good employment contract. So it, it can get difficult depending on what you're looking for. But even in this case the universe did it's job and to help me through Rigby, my recruitment agency.

And even though it was not part of the contract, and it was not promised at any time, they were able to help me find a nice apartment suitable for my needs. Where I am still living to this day and probably will for a while.

Kathrin: And of course you had the good job contract as well. So that helped, I'm sure.

Laura: That helped too.

Kathrin: Yeah.

Laura: Yeah. But it can get difficult. So yeah, even in these cases, when you need something that could be difficult to get, it helps having a good recruitment agency, for example, and it just means the world to know that you can count on someone if you need help and that can make your first contact with the country an enjoyable experience.

Kathrin: Yeah. So having someone already in the country who knows about these things is really helpful.

Laura: It really is, yeah.

Kathrin: And there's another thing that you have to do in the first months of working in Switzerland, which is getting a residence permit. Was that also just as easy to get your permit?

Laura: Yes. Getting the residence permit was as simple as two visits. One to register at the local office and one at immigration. I came prepared. I had with me all the necessary documents and just answered a few questions. It's really a simple process for EU citizens. It's made to be as quick as possible, but you really have to know what papers to have before you come here.

You need to prove not only your identity but also that you were an unproblematic citizen, for example. When it comes to debt, taxes, criminal records, things like that and some documents need to be translated into German. But once you have everything ready and come here, it's all done in a heartbeat. And you get the permit by post just like everything else. One day you'll find it in your mailbox.

Kathrin: Okay, so not too intimidating, just as long as I suppose you felt like with everything you follow the rules, you participate in the way you're, you know, meant to, then I suppose that there's no problems.

Laura: Exactly.

Kathrin: Is there anything else that sort of you wish you had known before making your move?

Laura: I wish I wouldn't worry that much really and not spend so much energy in trying to move all my life from day one because it is a new place you're adjusting to. So maybe it's a better idea to just give yourself some time to discover how you adjust and what this new side of you living here needs now.

So trying to think what's everything I'm going to need before moving to this new country is probably not going to help. You, you never know how things evolve and how your priorities change once you come here. For example before coming to Switzerland, I was very emotionally attached to my car. Back home, it gave me the flexibility to go anywhere and you really need a car to go around Bucharest. And maybe that's also the reason why the traffic is so bad because everybody thinks the same.

So when I came here, I spent a lot of time trying to figure out the things that I need to do to bring my car too because I thought I couldn't live without it. And everyone would tell me, you know, here we have trains and bikes and this thing public transport is exceptional but I was still not listen.

And I did bring my car at some point, paid a few fines, maybe took a road trip or two, but mostly kept it in the parking space for a couple of months and then gave up when I finally realised I really don't need it. And it's so much easier and quicker to go anywhere by train. And my priorities have changed and that's fine.

So my, my advice would be at the beginning, just take a suitcase with you and come here, you'll figure things out along the way.

Kathrin: Excellent. And so then now you've spent a year and a half or so in Switzerland, what have you found that you enjoy most about living in Switzerland?

Laura: Oh, I love that question. Where should I start? First of all, I have to say, I appreciate the laid-back lifestyle that people have here. And it's crazy when you think about it because it's such a vivid city full of ambitious young professionals coming to work. But at the same time, you get that small-town vibe too, with people relaxing with a cocktail by the lake or in the park and just enjoy being outdoors and having so many options to spend your time outdoors. In the city or outside the city and taking a hike or enjoying a dinner with a view, you know for me back home, being in nature was somehow reserved for the weekends or the holidays. It would involve probably a long drive or a flight to get to a good spot. But now it's just part of my day-to-day life. It could be lunchtime or after work, I can enjoy a view of the lake or the mountains. Just take a breath of fresh air. The lake is also one of my favourite places in Zürich, and it's really close and convenient, has such an amazing view and it's the place to be to find peace of mind at any time. So all these are just great perks that also help relieve stress. It all leads to that laid-back lifestyle I was telling you about.

Kathrin: Amazing. Yeah. Lots of work-life balance in Switzerland, isn't there? People seem to manage to do both.

Laura: Exactly. Exactly. And not only that, besides the laid-back lifestyle, there are also a lot of events happening around the city. So depending on what you like, I feel you can find an event tailored to that. It could be a concert, a restaurant or a game night or all sorts of meetings. I try to keep an eye open for that because there are a lot of groups and communities you can be part of so that you can know about these events. So yeah, there's always something to do not to mention that you can always travel.

Kathrin: That's right. Yeah. You can go to in two hours or so you're in some beautiful mountains or

Laura: Exactly. And all, all places are reachable by train. So you can just hop on and go anywhere. And I can assure you that you're going to enjoy the destination and the journey there because everything is so beautiful. It's like, it's taken out of a postcard and you're going to see a lot of amazing views. And tourism is also very well developed too. I noticed that. So besides sightseeing and the fact that nature is impressive, you also get this amazing touristic experience. Like your journey will be comfortable. You will have everything you need at all times. And there are a lot of things you can do as a tourist to have fun and just make the most of your time. So it’s really worth it to travel, make good memories, take awesome pictures.

Kathrin: Oh, yes. Impress all your friends back home with the pictures.

Laura: Yeah, oh, it's impressive. Yeah, I really recommend it.

Kathrin: And what about the quality of life? Have you noticed anything about it in Switzerland?

Laura: About the quality of life? I could start with the most basic things. Like the air, water, food, really strike you when you come here because everything is so clean. You can feel it. And the streets are so clean. The water from the fountains is drinkable. I guess it really shows how, if people are really invested into being environmentally friendly, then you can actually see the difference. And that is what's happening here. With the food, also. The base ingredients are high quality and just taste great. So maybe that's the reason, you know, I was thinking maybe that's the reason why Switzerland became so famous for the cheese and chocolate.

Kathrin: Probably, yeah.

Laura: Because maybe it all goes down to the quality of the milk and the other ingredients. So yeah, that is something you notice from start, when it comes to other aspects of life, you really have to appreciate the public transport that's very much reliable, and you can count on the app to get the correct time schedules at all times. It could happen that your train is delayed two minutes. Sometimes I look around me and people start getting impatient and anxious when that happens. But it's because they're used to not having that. But it happens so rarely that I'm not bothered by it. So it's all good.

Kathrin: I mean, they have, they have to say it in the train station. If the train is more than three minutes late, they have to announce it. So they try to minimise that obviously.

Laura: Yeah. But overall is really reliable.

Kathrin: That's right.

Laura: Yeah.

Kathrin: I think in many other countries, they, you know, plus minus five minutes, they don't really let you know so much as in Switzerland where it's like, "Oh, your train's going to be three minutes late".

Laura: Exactly. Because it's just something that normally happens so.

Kathrin: That's right. Yeah. So is there anything else about quality of life?

Laura: Yeah, so there are so many things. Another thing I was pleasantly surprised by was the quality of the apartments and the buildings here. The standard is pretty high so no matter where you go, the place is going to be clean and functional. So this is not a given. In other cities you could run into issues.

Kathrin: I agree. You could totally run into issues like here in England. For example, I remember my first apartment. I had to clean the kitchen for about 10 hours because it was so dirty from the last tenants. And also, a lot of people have problems with mould when they, you know, here, when they rent privately, but in Switzerland, you wouldn't really be able to find an apartment with mould, would you?

Laura: Yeah, that's true. I'm, I'm almost sure that can happen. So it's shocking, you know, because I keep hearing that all the time in, in other very popular cities people run into issues. And my brother lives in New York and he has some horror stories to tell. I hear about London all the time.

Kathrin: Those are really popular cities and they're almost as expensive as Switzerland, right? So you'd expect the quality to be equal, but it's really, sometimes it isn't.

Laura: Exactly. So I was very surprised when I came here. I myself love my little apartment. It's in a new building and it has great finishings and materials and it's very well isolated to preserve energy. You know, I, I never ran into any malfunctioning so far. So everything just makes sense.

Kathrin: Hmm. Excellent. And so was there anything about life in Switzerland that's very different to what you were used to or that you first had to get used to?

Laura: Well, like I said in the beginning I come from Bucharest, born and raised. Population around 2.5 million people - that is quite a lot. I've always been into the big city life and somehow I always saw myself living like that. Even when I was thinking of relocating, I would consider London or New York or a place like that. So that was a concern when I had to come here because I didn't know if I would be able to adjust to living in a smaller city. If I would have everything I need and not feel suffocated, you know?

Kathrin: Right. Yes.

Laura: For example, I knew that in Switzerland, like in other European countries, the shops have limited open time

Kathrin: Yes.

Laura: And are also closed on the weekends. And I usually don't do well with that, not even on vacation. So I was really stressing about that.

Kathrin: Okay.

Laura: But even though that is the general rule when you live in Zürich, I was surprised to see that you can find a store open near you outside of these hours. So I guess there are more people like me out there and it's become a practice.

Kathrin: And in the train station as well, you can find that inside the train station shopping mall, it's always open on Sundays as well, isn't it?

Laura: Exactly, yeah. I am lucky to live close to Zürich Hauptbahnhof and that is just like you say, it's like a mall, like a maze of all different stores you can think of. And it's open during the weekends too. It is a bit tricky to navigate and to find your way through there.

Kathrin: For sure. I always struggle.

Laura: Well, if you go often enough, you get to learn it by heart.

Kathrin: Yes. I think so.

Laura: Yeah. Yeah.

Kathrin: And another thing, of course, is the language that, you know, with German and Swiss German, a lot of people worry if they're going to adjust to the language situation.

Laura: That was not an issue for me, really because Zürich is such an international environment. Everybody speaks English so I didn't really need to speak German, I was able to go around for a year and a half now knowing just “Mit Karte bitte”.

Kathrin: Yeah. So the basics.

Laura: The basics. At some point I'm going to take German classes, but not because I need to, but because everyone around me does it and it would be fun to learn.

Kathrin: And a nice way also maybe to meet other expats.

Laura: Exactly. Exactly.

Kathrin: Okay. Do you have any other tips for living in Switzerland?

Laura: Well, my number one tip would be to be social as much as possible and meet new people, go to events, language exchanges, learn new skills. Why not There are so many different classes you can sign up for and just have fun in the process.

It doesn't matter what it is. A lot of people go for Salsa lessons, I noticed. I signed up for acting classes at some point. Did I need to do that? Of course not. It was a choice. But, It also helped me in my job, you know, when I do presentations and have to tell a data story, it really helped. So you never know. There are a lot of different, very interesting things to do out there. Just try to be open minded. And these are the things that will make your time here more enjoyable.

Kathrin: Yes.

Laura: You can build your circle of friends. You know I feel that some communities are very welcoming. And in that sense, for example, I find it very easy to connect with Spanish, South American, Italian people because we have a lot in common and I can also speak the language, so it can be easy to make friends outside your community.

Kathrin: Yeah. So, I mean, there's some, some interest groups for almost every interest, so you'll be able to find something that you enjoy and even if you have to do a bit of trial and error and go to different groups, eventually you'll find one, I'm sure.

Laura: You will find your tribe, yeah. And it's always a good idea to connect also with your own people and share experiences. I am always happy to meet Romanians in Zürich and that's a different experience but it's good to have diversity in your day-to-day life, you know.

Kathrin: Exactly. So let's talk a little bit about working in Switzerland now, since that's what kind of what you came here for. If someone is listening to this and thinking, "I'd like to do that", how do you think they could increase their chances of getting a job in Switzerland?

Laura: Firstly, it really helps if you work in a field that's in high demand in Switzerland, like IT, for example. But then after that there are certain things you can do to increase your chances of getting contacted by a Swiss employer or recruitment agency. I find that a good portfolio is the best move to make yourself more visible. I myself put a lot of effort into building up my portfolio, participating in challenges, international competitions. Being active in the data community world.

I was always looking to extend my professional network and reach out to people who work in a similar field as I do. I guess it really helps to just work at building your personal brand and basically have a good public profile. It all leads to you getting job proposals. And once you begin a recruitment process, you will be competing with so many other good professionals out there. So you need to be prepared for it too. It's always good to have a well written resume that will make you stand out. And that is not as straightforward as just laying out the things you did in the past. I find that a lot of people don't know how to write a good resume to really highlight their accomplishments more than anything.

Kathrin: Okay. So maybe talking to a professional about that, if you don't know how to do it, or at least doing a lot of research about it.

Laura: Exactly. There, there are companies who can help you with this who would do just that and offer consultancy. It's really important. For example, if you find yourself getting job offers that are not for you, maybe you don't have the right the correct keywords in your profile or resume and you could miss out on good opportunities out there that would be more suitable for you. So it is really important but then somehow the deciding factor would be how you conduct yourself during the interview. And that is a skill that is built over time and really requires practice. I've always been constantly participating in interviews my entire professional life.

Kathrin: Yeah, so you have a lot of experience.

Laura: I do. And it's also the best way to get to know yourself better and what your strengths are and just get to gauge the demand that is in your field. What other skills you might want to consider. And just getting that practice of presenting yourself as a professional. So my advice is always go to as many interviews as you possibly can, get as much practice, so that when your dream job comes along, you're going to be ready to ace that interview and get an offer.

Kathrin: Right. So can you describe what it's like to work for a Swiss company? So maybe starting with, you know, where it is and how do you get there every day?

Laura: It is very easy to get to work every day thanks to the public transport like I was telling you about. And we were also talking about that laid-back lifestyle and I feel that somehow it also reflects in the work environment because there is this important focus on work-life balance.

Kathrin: Yes.

Laura: It is not expected of you to work overtime.

Kathrin: Okay.

Laura: But even during work hours. You will not be burdened with many conflicting things to deliver at once. You know, if you're a multitasker, then that's amazing, good for you. For example, I am not, but somehow I feel it's not expected of me to be, you know, the focus is more on the quality of work and sustainable achievements in time rather than just quantity and fast results.

Kathrin: That's right. And then a lot of branches, I think also the working hours are legally limited. So you're not allowed in certain branches like office work I think you're not allowed to work, I'm not quite sure about the figure, but more than a certain amount, which then makes it easy, you know, for the employees, because they have more rights than maybe in other countries.

Laura: Yeah, exactly. So that, is a rule. It also applies in my case and it's just general practice.

Kathrin: That's right.

Laura: Yeah, so there is this you know also focus on people getting together and collaboration because there are a lot of events happening all the time throughout the year. We always have something coming up like team events. And we do those often because we really are a bunch of people who just genuinely enjoy spending time with each other. So we try to do those activities as often as possible, but there are also department events or dinners. Hosted by our management, sports competitions. I think right now there is soccer tournament going on in the bank. Yeah. I didn't sign up for it because I didn't want to embarrass myself, but yeah, there are a lot of things happening all the time. Events sponsored by the bank where employees can attend. Last year I went for a classical concert in Tonhalle, which is an amazing location.And I also went for the Formula E circuit in Monaco.

Kathrin: Oh, wow.

Laura: So yeah, there's, there's always something happening and you can tell it's in the culture of the company to just encourage people to connect with each other.

Kathrin: So quite a social workplace.

Laura: It is yeah. And you know, it makes doing your job so much easier when you have to share, exchange information. So it's a focus on collaboration between people and somehow it improves the working atmosphere and just the results in the end, because. that's what matters.

Kathrin: That's right. So obviously if you already have a good connection with your co-workers, then it's much easier, everything at work, isn't it?

Laura: Exactly. Much, much easier.

Kathrin: So overall, a very good experience for you in Switzerland.

Laura: I can say that. Yeah.

Kathrin: Do you have any final pieces of advice for people or insights for anyone considering the move?

Laura: Well, if you're listening to this, because you are thinking of relocating to Switzerland or maybe you already have a job offer on the table and you're weighing your options, not knowing what to do. If anything, I hope that listening to this can be that encouragement you need to take a leap of faith. This is definitely not for everyone, but if you're open and really want to improve as a person and as a professional, this is a very good experience to go through and just trust the process.

Kathrin: And don't believe everything you read on the internet.

Laura: Exactly.

Kathrin: That's it. All right. So thank you so much. And how can people connect with you if they have a question or they would just want to reach out and network? How can they find you?

Laura: Well, I am present on social media. You can find me on LinkedIn, Laura Vrinceanu.

I often get messages there from people looking for either career advice or relocation tips. I am always happy to help. So if you do have questions, don't hesitate to reach out. And follow me if you want to know how this journey will continue in the future. And I'll be preparing some interesting content very soon. See you there.

Kathrin: Excellent. All right. So that's it for today. So thanks again to our guest, Laura, for joining us.

Laura: Thank you very much, Kathrin.

Kathrin: And thanks to you for listening. We'll include links in the show notes to our guests and to further materials about some of the topics that we've spoken about today.

If you enjoyed the episode, please leave a review on your favourite podcast platform. Once again, this podcast was brought to you by Rigby. We're a staffing and project services company here in Zürich. If you would like our help either to hire or to be hired, let us know. Best way to do that is by going to rigby.ch/apply and filling out the form. You can also sign up for our newsletter at rigby.ch/newsletter to receive our Living In Switzerland guide. We'll send you one email per month about expat focused news and jobs in Switzerland. So thanks and until the next time.

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