Podcast
Topics covered
- Swiss German vs. high German
- Who needs to learn Swiss German?
- Is it better to start with Swiss German or high German?
- Best ways to learn
Who We're Speaking With
In this episode, we speak to Rahel Roth and Sergio Lievano about Swiss German.
Rahel is a Swiss German teacher originally from St. Gallen in Switzerland. Her series of books, Swiss German for English Speakers, is one of the few resources that teaches Swiss German from scratch.
Sergio is a cartoonist, creative artist and bestselling author, originally from Colombia. He has been living in Switzerland for many years and has been working for Swiss companies like Swissotel, the SBB and Syngenta. And most importantly, he has published two books in Colombia and six in Switzerland, including The Indispensable Illustrated Dictionary of Swiss German.
About the Episode
The German-speaking part of Switzerland has a very diverse and interesting linguistic landscape. Although written communication is in standard German, people speak to each other in a collection of dialects called Swiss German. Expats often wonder how this language differs from high German, whether they have to learn it, and how to get started.
Learning Swiss German is a good idea for people who are planning to stay in German-speaking Switzerland long-term, have children in the school system, and want to fully integrate into the local culture. Here’s how to start:
- Formal study: The structure of Swiss German is slightly simpler than that of high German. Knowing some of the rules can simplify and speed up the learning process. You can study Swiss German on your own or in a class using resources like Rahel’s book. Contrary to popular opinion, you don’t need to speak fluent high German to learn Swiss German.
- Vocabulary: Understanding Swiss German is much more important than speaking it. As long as you can understand their dialect, Swiss people won’t mind if you answer them in standard German. That’s why learning vocabulary, for example with Sergio’s dictionary, is important.
- Practice: The only way to become fully fluent is to practice your Swiss German. Take every opportunity you can to listen to and interact with Swiss German speakers. You’ll be surprised at how quickly you pick it up.
Resources
Swiss German for Everyone by Rahel Roth
Swiss German for English Speakers - number 1 on Amazon on this topic
Next steps
If you got something out of the podcast then please leave a review on your favourite platform. Thank you for listening.
Check out current job opportunities in Switzerland
Send us a spontaneous application
Sign up for our newsletter and receive our Living in Switzerland Welcome ebook guide.
Transcript
Hello everybody and welcome to another episode of Living in Switzerland. The series is brought to you by Rigby. We are a staffing and IT services company based in Zurich. If you or anyone you know of is looking for a new role in Switzerland, or if you're looking to hire, let us know. We'd be happy to help. The best way to do that is by sending an email to contact@rigby.ch.
Today we are joined by two Swiss German experts, Rahel Roth and Sergio Lievano.
Rahel is a Swiss German teacher and also originally from St. Gallen in Switzerland.
Her series of books, Swiss German for English Speakers, is one of the few resources that teaches Swiss German from scratch.
Rahel, welcome.
Hi, thanks for having me.
All right, let's start with you telling us just a little bit about your background and how you got into teaching Swiss German.
So I've always been interested in languages, especially their structure. So I studied Spanish and English at university and attended several language courses just to get to know a little bit more about the structure of languages.
During my studies at high school to become… at the university to become a high school teacher for Spanish and English, I started teaching German. And I noticed that a lot of students were struggling with high German as they couldn't really use it in their daily life. And they were therefore really frustrated.
So one day, a woman contacted me and she told me that everyone around her was telling her to learn high German. But she actually didn't want to. She needed Swiss German. And I decided to create material for her and made it my goal to teach her Swiss German.
All right, so it all started with that one student.
Exactly. She was the first one and the main one, which is why I started creating material. Yes.
Right. And how exactly do your online lessons work? As I understand that you only teach online, right?
Exactly. I work online. I usually use, in my classes, online screen sharing, which is great. It works very well because it shows students what we are working on. They see it right in front of of them. So it's like having a teacher right next to you.
And usually I take notes. I send out the notes after class. And that really helps the students to really focus only on the language. And on speaking, they don't really have to worry about the notes being perfect.
I usually complement my lessons with virtual games like four in a row or quizzes. And especially in a group, that's fun.
As Swiss German, as Swiss German is a spoken and very diverse language, videos and songs also allow to look at different accents in a realistic setting. So we also include videos and usually after a certain amount of classes I hand out learning assessments which actually gives me an overview about how the student is doing and it also shows the student how well he's doing and what he should review maybe.
Right, so it's really quite a structured approach.
Exactly, so I usually try to focus on a structure, so also the student knows where we are, and they feel kind of guided in their learning.
Right. And as you know, I also teach German, high German, not Swiss German. And I also mainly teach online. And in some ways, I think it's almost easier. It almost works better than teaching in person, because you have this immediate screen sharing and the immediate feedback from the student online.
Absolutely. Absolutely. Depending on what exactly you work on, you can even use
things like Google documents and you can work simultaneously. And that actually is a big advantage compared to classes in person because you don't see what the student takes notes of. So you don't see if what the student writes down is correct or not. And actually virtually you see that and you can directly correct.
And it's like a whiteboard and many people like myself included, I for example, can write more quickly online than on paper. So actually if I'm making notes, it's usually quicker on Google documents.
Absolutely.
So teaching Swiss German is very niche. So who is your typical student? Is there a typical profile of who you tend to teach or just anyone?
It's basically expats. So anybody that comes to the German-speaking part of Switzerland, and anybody that speaks English. So I have students from Germany, England, Australia, India, United States, they usually all come to Switzerland at some point. Sometimes they're even living already in Switzerland, they've moved there several years ago, and they're still struggling with the language.
And even for many expats, high German is not required. So like when they work in an international company, or they don't need to take a test for residency or work, then the motivation to learn high German is quite low. And at the same time, they, they realize that without high German or Swiss German, they're simply not able to interact with locals, with Swiss people.
So they learn only Swiss German? They don't have to start with standard German? That's interesting.
Right. Yeah, usually…
You wouldn’t typically think that.
Yeah. Exactly. Most people would tell you you have to start with high German. And that's where external influence comes in. Because a lot of people are very influenced, and they think it's impossible to learn Swiss German without any high German, or that's it, that it's a stupid idea.
But it actually isn't. It's like another language. Of course, you have to consider how long you will be staying in Switzerland. But if you really want to live there, you want to raise your children there, then starting with Swiss German is a great opportunity.
So you get a lot of people who have children and maybe the children are picking it up from peers or...
Exactly. So usually the kids, they learn from kindergarten, Kita, with their friends. They usually, they grow up like Swiss children. But the parents struggle because the parents realize once they go to Kita, that uh-oh, my child is learning Swiss German and he will bring home friends that speak Swiss German. And I'm left out. And if you then also are married to a Swiss man or woman, then you have the majority of your family speaking Swiss German and you have no idea what they're talking about. And that's usually when they realize, ‘I have to study.’
That makes sense. Let's talk a little bit in general about Swiss German. What do you see as the principal differences between Swiss German and standard, or, what's called high German?
Okay, so first of all, I believe it's very important to understand the difference because Swiss German is often taken as the Swiss standard German, which it's not. It's a dialect. It's an inofficial language. It's something that we speak and not write.
And there is, the thing that makes it quite complicated because apparently there are no spelling rules. So you can write the words the way you want. And usually for students that makes it very complicated.
However, it's also something that can make it richer because you're quite free in your spelling. You don't have to worry too much about how to spell things because it's a spoken language.
For example, the word Swiss German, "Schwiizerdütsch". When you say it, it sounds the same in almost all dialects.
But when you spell it, you can spell it with one "i", "Schwizerdütsch".
You can spell it with two "i's". It sounds the same.
You can even spell it with a "y".
You could change it even to "Schwiizertütsch" with a "t" in the front.
Right, yes, I've seen that.
But you can’t spell it with a "tz”. "Schwitzerdütsch" with a "tz" doesn't work. Because we have some, kind of, rules that we know compared to high German that we still apply.
So there are not no rules, but some rules. And that's very difficult for learners.
And that's where your classes come in and that's what you teach.
Right. So we usually try to include different spellings, different words, so that visually the word looks different. But when you pronounce it, students figure out what it means, and that's actually what it's all about. It's something, it's about deciphering what it could mean. It's looking for the meaning of the word. And once a student gets used to looking for the meaning of the word, it's way easier to understand all the different dialects.
So you think people can eventually learn to communicate with locals from all over Switzerland, not just in their little region?
Yes. Yes. Maybe not at the very, very high level. I mean, high level very technically because that's even for me as a native Swiss speaker sometimes difficult.
Okay, there are words that I learned that I didn't know before because I didn't grow up in that area.
But usually that are words that you maybe use once or twice in your life. So you don't really have to worry too much about that. You just ask ‘what's that?’
Yeah.
And you learn something new.
If you know the basics, yeah, you can communicate then.
Exactly.
All right, so let's imagine that someone completely new to Switzerland is coming to live and work here. And they just get very confused because there’s French, there’s Italian, there’s German, and then there’s this Swiss German. They don't know where to start. So where would you suggest? Do you think they should learn Swiss German or standard German first? And what is more helpful for them in this situation?
Okay, so first of all, they would have to decide where they would like to live in Switzerland. If they move to the German-speaking area, it's between, the decision is between High German and Swiss German. Now it depends on each student because they should consider, do they need German for work? Do they need to write emails or read texts? In that case, they would have to go for High German. Also, if they need a test for integration, because all these things are in the official language of the country, which is High German.
And then later on, you can also focus on Swiss German. You can compare, you can take a course and you adapt, you know, in high German. But if you study at the same time, it usually confuses because they're very similar. And then you're making more bad than good because you're confusing.
And what you actually have to do in a test is writing proper high German. And if you include Swiss words or Swiss spellings, that will all count as mistakes. So that's for you a disadvantage.
However, if they say they work in an English-speaking environment, they have kids at home, they need to do everyday tasks like do the shopping, they have to interact with caretakers and teachers. And then Swiss German is definitely the better choice because that's what we speak.
So usually Swiss people, they all know high German, they understand. But usually they probably will answer in Swiss German as well. So it's good to have some knowledge of the language.
Okay, so it really depends on what the expat, the new person is trying to achieve in a way.
Yes, absolutely.
How, what is the best approach to learning Swiss German then? If someone's now decided, ‘yeah, I want to get started with Swiss German.’ Maybe they know a little bit of high German, but not much. What's the most effective approach?
To open up your mind. You have to be very open towards Swiss German and the different variants. So like we said before, it's about deciphering the meanings of the words. So you actually, you shouldn't too much worry about the visual appearance of a word.
A lot of students are used to, first of all, read and try to understand written things, which in Swiss German is actually not bad, but I wouldn't recommend it because you focus too much on writing and it's a spoken language. So from the beginning on, you should focus on speaking and hearing. So you get used to different forms. And usually I tell my students when you see a word you don't know what it means, pronounce it, say it out loud and it will help you a lot.
If I receive a message, I'm from St. Gallen, I receive a message from my friend in Bern. Sometimes I have to read it out loud to see what this could mean because when I see it it's like what's that? Because I've never seen so many O's and two dots or A's and two dots. I don't know what it means because we don't have a visual connection to the word. We have an oral connection to the word. So I think that's one of the most important points.
And then also including a lot of different variants. So the more different spellings you include, the more different versions you include, the more you get used to understanding different things. And then you pick out the one that you hear around you, that's the one that you use.
But you can compare it to a child. A child, when it learns on TV, it hears a lot of different people. And it still understands them, but it uses one form, the one that the family uses. And that's actually what you should do as a Swiss German learner.
Yeah. And it doesn't really make sense to only focus on your area because a lot of people, Swiss people, they move around the country as well. So among your neighbors, you might have people from Basel and people from Zurich and people from Bern, even if you live in a different city, you'll have various variants around you.
Exactly.
And it's easy as well. You're in a different, completely different area within an hour or even half an hour. So.
Yeah, yeah, or even less. Yes.
Yeah.
And even on TV, so you have, for example, the weather forecast. Sometimes it's a person from, I don't know, Basel maybe that presents the weather forecast. If you've never heard someone from Basel, you will not understand a single word. And that's even though it's quite similar.
So the more you include these different forms with videos or different spellings and messages, the more you get used to it.
Yeah, I think that's important. Let's talk a little bit more about the different variants. Does this confuse your students to have all these various forms and do you ever encounter issues or not so much?
Usually in the beginning, yes, it has confused them because they're not used to it. It's a very unique language, Swiss-German, and I think that's also something that makes it very special because we have this richness in spellings in the different dialects.
Yeah, very unusual.
Yes, yes, exactly. So usually you have like a dictionary or something that gives you the guidelines for the language. You spell the word this way and that's it. You don't have any other option. And for people that learn visually, that's very important to have structure.
And then when they come to Swiss German, they suddenly say, ‘oh, you can have a lot of different forms, you can conjugate the verb in different forms.’ So the verb doesn't always appear in the same form for the same person.
Yeah.
And they need to get used to that. So usually in the beginning, I tell them, don't worry too much about making everything perfect. Because even if you make maybe a mistake, which is not a mistake in Swiss German, usually it's simply a different dialect. Leaving out an N somewhere or leaving out a D somewhere, it doesn't really have to be wrong. It's just a different form. And because they're not used to the different dialects, that's considered okay, that's normal.
So I think in the beginning, they should just start learning. And the more they advance, they will realize that their dialect is maybe a little bit different from another one, that they can take words from a different dialect, they can include them, they can choose which form they prefer best.
And then they construct their own form.
I think, yeah, that's helpful. So you created a series of books. I think you said that the third one is coming out soon.
Right.
Swiss German for English Speakers.
Right.
Why did you decide to write your own books instead of using materials already out there?
Because there is almost nothing. So you find some materials, usually the books that I've seen when I started creating material were usually for German speakers. They required at least the B1 level in high German. And that means usually until a student gets to a B1 level, either it's an intensive course or they need years.
So also in language schools, a lot of language schools, they require a B1 level at least. And I think for some people, it just doesn't make sense to go through high German first.
Yeah…
You could start…
Just wastes a lot of … they have to spend a lot of time, and by the time they speak Swiss German, maybe…
Yeah, time and money and effort. Yeah. So they start with Swiss German maybe, and then later on they can include things. So I start already in the first book, for example, when we talk about the calendar, I include high German words for the weekdays and the months. Because when they see a calendar, they will see the high German form. And they need to understand that for example, ‘Montag’ is Monday, but when they talk to someone else, they would say "Mäntig".
So we practice that in class that they are used to seeing ‘Montag’ on the paper, but then when they talk to each other, they say "Mäntig". And then in Book two a little bit more, and in Book three it's already about understanding maybe a message from someone that writes in high German, but they respond in Swiss German. And then with that, they get used to understanding.
There are also transformation rules. You can transform words from high German to Swiss German, not 100%, but that helps you a lot to understand the changes.
What's an example?
For example, house. ‘Haus’ in high German is the same. You spell it a little bit different, but it's house. And when you transform it to Swiss German, you say "Huus". So the AU, the combination of the AU usually changes to "UU". So if you know that rule, you can transform "Maus".
Oh yeah.
Which turns into?
"Muus".
"Muus". Yeah, right. Okay, and then you have other words like this, prepositions, ‘auf,’ turns into ‘uuf.’
Oh, right.
Instead of going from high German to Swiss German, you can go the other way around. So you say the ‘uu’ turns into ‘au’ and then you go from "Huus" to "Haus".
Oh, right. Yes. So that's really helpful for learners. As a native, you don't think about these things. But when you're learning, you can progress much faster once you know the rules.
Right? And then actually you're learning one language instead of two. I mean, probably they're not going to speak high German, okay, maybe with time. But at first they focus on comprehension.
So when they read a text that they receive from the government or a Gemeinde, that they at least understand what is written here, even though maybe they can't pronounce or respond.
Right. How did you compile all these materials? So I imagine writing a whole language book from scratch must be very challenging. So how did you go about doing that?
So it's basically thanks to my first student that asked me to do that. When she asked me, I said, "Okay, we try. I will come up with something that I think is interesting for you." Or based on what she told me about her life, things that she would need. I tried to come up with exercises, with rules.
And then you basically think about examples and then you figure out the rule. The more sentences you compare with each other, you see, okay, this could be like this. You form a kind of a rule and then it either confirms the more examples you have or in class you see there is something you need to add, there's something you need to take out.
Maybe there is something that you skip the part and then you realize, oh no, the students struggles, and you include a new exercise. So I actually, before publishing the first book, I did the book several times with my students.
Okay.
And from the the draft from the very first class with my first student up to the public… when I published the book, it underwent a lot of changes. So when you compare the two forms, that's a whole world in between.
Lots of, sort of, trial and error, experience, learning by doing.
Absolutely.
And so obviously you use your book together with your classes, but can someone use it without a teacher?
Yeah, you could try. It's, the idea first was that students can use it on their own. It's quite self-explanatory, so you can do that.
You also receive, together with the book, access to a Google Drive folder. You can download there the audio files for the book, for pronunciation and exercises. You have a vocabulary list, you have the solutions, you have the transcripts, you have something like an alphabetical word list to look up words in the book.
And you also have access to flashcards. So actually you could study on your own. The advantage of having a teacher is guided learning, that you have the structure of a teacher. You can ask questions anytime. You can include things that you maybe hear on the street or when talking to other people. And that usually helps a lot. That can bring you a lot further.
Yeah, it would make sense that then you can go back and ask your teacher if you get confused or, yes. All right, Rahel, that was really interesting. Thank you so much.
You too.
Tell us as a last thing, how can listeners find out about you and contact you if they're interested in either your book or your classes?
All right. So on my website, you find all the information. It's www.swissgerman
then hyphen for everyone.ch (www.swissgerman-foreveryone.ch). And there you find all the information about the book, about my classes, about me.You also have a demo lesson where you can see more or less how it works.
Yeah. And anything else you can contact me by mail through the website.
Okay, perfect. That's great. And as always, we'll link to that in the show notes so you could just click directly.
Perfect.
(upbeat music)
Now, we'll speak to Sergio Lievano. Sergio is a cartoonist, creative artist and bestselling author, originally from Colombia. He has been living in Switzerland for many years and has been working for Swiss companies like Swissotel, the SBB and Syngenta. And most importantly, he has published six books in Switzerland and two in Colombia.
Sergio, welcome.
Thank you, Kathrin. Hello. Good morning.
Let's start by you telling us just a little bit about your expat journey and what brought you to Switzerland.
Okay. Well, as for many, many foreigners here in Switzerland, I fell in love. I fell deeply in love with a Swiss nurse. And we were living in England, in Canterbury.
All right, okay.
And one day we just decided to, I was… I’m an economist, that's my education. And then one day I decided to change to be a cartoonist and my Swiss wife said, "Now that you're going to change to be a cartoonist, why don't we go to Switzerland more?"
Oh, right, yes. It's less location-dependent.
Yeah, it sounds very obvious. So, okay, perfect. So we came to Switzerland and I started this journey of Switzerland and Swiss German and everything that came with it, which has been amazing.
So, presumably you didn't know any German before you came. So how did you start?
No, no, actually I was a little bit naïve because I really, really thought that German was just German. You know, that you could find different accents like in Spanish, that the Spanish from Ecuador, Colombia or Spain, they're different but basically the same Spanish.
So I thought that German was going to be the same. So I went to my first classes in Migros Schule and there, I mean, my wife always told me about Swiss German, but I kind of understood the concept, but I was absolutely wrong.
So when I went to Migros Schule, they made it very clear that one thing was high German and another world was the dialect that they were using.
Yeah,
The Swiss German. Yeah. And I say, no problem. I will start to read and learn about Swiss German.
They say, no, that's the thing. No, it's a dialect. It's not a language. It’s a dialect.
And from there things started to be very strange for me.
Yeah, it is a bit strange if you don't know about it, right?
Oh, absolutely. I mean, I really thought that. I really can understand it, but then people started to talk to me in Swiss German trying to help me to kind of like, synchronize my ear to the environment, if you can say it like that.
And it was not bad at the beginning. I tried to follow my wife talking and her family. But then I very, very soon realized that everyone has a different way to speak this Swiss German.
Yeah, that's right.
And in the same region, they have different ways to say things. So it's kind of like a roller coaster adventure in language.
So do you think it's necessary to learn Swiss German if you want to settle for a long time in Switzerland?
Absolutely. I think that Swiss German, I mean, although the Swiss will always tell you as soon as you arrive to Switzerland, the Swiss are very nice, they will always tell you, ‘Look, don't worry about Swiss German. Concentrate on high German. You can move around with English, if English is your main language or you know English.’
And it's fairly true. And it's true. However, the Swiss will not push you in any moment to learn Swiss German, because there is no way to say ‘you have to learn this Swiss German or that Swiss German.’
They just assume that you will get it in the street when you go and buy things. They assume that thing.
And so I thought I was easy, perfect. So I will try to connect to that Swiss German. However, it's very important for the foreigner that as soon as you start to use words or try to, it's kind of like an acceptance to say, ‘Okay, this is the Swiss German, this is the Swiss German world’ and people actually, because it's the language in the streets, people actually will be happy not that you speak in Swiss German, but that you understand Swiss German, which is different but more important than to speak it.
They don't care if you don't talk Swiss German, but it's very important for them that you understand their Swiss German, because if you make them talk in high German, they're not going to be very happy. I mean, yes, it's...
That's right, yeah. They sometimes even prefer to speak English, don't they, than high German.
Totally. Because they know that with high German, they're going to be evaluated in a way, because of their high German knowledge. But with English, when you use English good or bad, it doesn't matter, but they make themselves better understood. So yeah, absolutely.
So do you think Swiss German is quite hard to learn or a little bit easier than high German?
It depends on the groups where you are. I mean, it depends on the people around you. It depends how active you are in Switzerland.
Before I arrived, there was no really good books about Swiss German. To be fair, the books that I found about Swiss German were written by kind of academic people. It was more like dictionaries. There's nice red books with a lot of words there and everything like that, but nothing to tell you, "Hey, don't worry. This cannot be that difficult.”
So it was a little bit difficult for me. Of course, I'm a cartoonist, so my interaction with people has been always very, very little. I basically sit down and draw, so I don't have a face-to-face. I don't go a lot to talk to people and things like that.
But the people I met that they immediately interact with the Swiss German world, they connect with the language very fast and it happens something very unique, very, very nice there.
Unfortunately, I was not in that, I didn't have that opportunity.
Right, so people who maybe spend more time with others or with natives, they'll have a much easier time picking it up.
Totally, absolutely. I mean, Swiss German, you can only learn Swiss German going out, talking, asking for things, going to Migros to buy the bread because the woman at the till will say the price to you, how much you have to pay, and you absolutely are not going to understand what she's saying. And even if you say, "Please, again," and she's saying again with the same tone, with the same speed, and you still don't know, but the more you are outside there interacting, the better.
But books, it's a key thing. I mean, if you find like the books I did, the Survival Guide that I call, because it's something that really, really needs to be there. It helps you to say, "Ah, what I'm saying is more or less this."
So, you think a mix of actually speaking to people, but then also going home and having a look at the books and thinking about it. So that would be the easiest way. Is that how you would start? So if you were to come again to Switzerland as a brand-new expat, what would you do or what would you do differently to make it easy for yourself to learn German, Swiss German?
I mean, of course, I'm the author of a great Survival Guide, which is great because I love it. So maybe it's biased what I'm saying, but if I had to come back, I would get a book like this one. There's something that I say to you, "Don't worry, look, the easy things, if you want to say hello, this is the way, normal way to say hello, but this is also another way."
Or if you want to say a little phrase to be polite, then say this, say that. So basically, if you start to understand these words, these sentences, these key things. And then you come to Switzerland or you start to interact in Switzerland and then you realize that, that is not that difficult, that it’s not that weird, then it's a big, big help. It's a really, really big help.
Right. So get some context before you even move maybe or just right away.
Yeah, I mean, the important thing is to come here with, with just the heart of getting involved with the Swiss German and everything like that. Not, not contact. I mean, if you can get books to help a little bit, great. But the only way to, that helps is to be in the streets to talk with people, to interact with the Migros lady, although you don't understand what they're saying, which today I still struggle, but that's another story.
But over time it gets easier, I suppose, the more you interact. So just put yourself out there in a way.
Yeah, I met a bartender. I mean, he’s from Norway and he said that he arrived, he told me that he arrived to Switzerland three months ago. But the guy was working in front of the bar and talking to people in Swiss German. And although he was not very fluent according to him because I didn't really get it, but he was really swimming.
No, he was perfect, he said to me ‘Look, talk to people, interact to people, you need to get to a place where you can be, you can just interact, interact with all these things.’
Which is beautiful because nowadays people are not interacting that much, so it's a … German in a way, it's making you go out and enrich people.
Yeah, exactly. So even maybe as you said, a job is a good idea like that being a… that bartender or something that's very people focused. But I suppose if you don't have a job like that, you could also do it with just everyday interactions, maybe volunteering or joining a group, things like that.
Oh, absolutely. I mean, there's many people, especially expats that come to Switzerland and say, ‘Hey, look, I am very active, I go to the gym or I am in a mom group or in a dog group.’
This is key. So I always tell them, ‘You have to go out. You have to meet people, the key thing is to meet people.’ Even if they are expats and they’re going to be very much easier to you because you will talk in English, but also they are interacting with Swiss.
So you will get very slowly the rhythm of the language, the interaction, the rhythm of the culture, the way they interact, the way they open to you, which is the key thing to learn Swiss German.
Right, that makes sense. So thank you so much, Sergio, for joining us. And if you'd like to buy one of Sergio's books, you can find them at survivalbooks.ch.